VaHerps.com
Welcome to VaHerps!!

Please feel free to create an account and post to the discussion and classified forums. If you have any problems registering, please email me at Focal@VaHerps.com

User accounts must be activated by Admin and may be delayed. Please do NOT create a second account if you already have one and contact the email above for any questions.

Thanks!

Every right implies a responsibility; Every opportunity, an obligation; Every possession, a duty. -John D. Rockefeller
 
HomeHome  PortalPortal  FAQFAQ  RegisterRegister  Log in  

Share | 
 

 Would like some public opinion please!

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
Thereddog
Member
Member
avatar

Posts : 25

PostSubject: Would like some public opinion please!   Sun Oct 11, 2015 9:46 am

There's a situation out there that I know of and would like to get some opinions from the seasoned vets as well as new blood in the reptile hobby. Ok this is the situation:
First, all 3 individuals involved are doing reptiles as a second form of income and none do this as a main income business.
Ok I will call breeder #1 Chuck, #2 Rob, and #3 Bob.
Chuck is set up beside Rob at a reptile show. They knew who each other were but hadn't done business before. Since the show was slow, they spent a lot of time talking. Rob finds out Chuck is getting an adult breeder from someone coming to the show for a good friend(Bob) who doesn't live around that area. It turns out this type of snake is what Rob specializes in. None with the show being slow, Rob tells Chuck to see if his friend Bob was interested in anything he had on his table, which included several breeder females of the same type he was already getting for him. So, Chuck, wanting to help out another vender, as well as his good friend sends some pics of Robs table to Bob. Now to cut some non-essential info out, Rob makes a deal with Bob on a specific genetic female and Chuck agrees to pay for it for Bob and they make the deal. Chuck pays and will deliver the snake a month later when him and Bob meet up. Now Rob, saying he was thankful for Chuch helping with a $2000 sale says he'd sell it to Chuck for $1800 or give him a baby off his table that could be sold for $300-400 if raised up a little more, so Chuck takes the snake.
Flash forward 5 weeks(or so) later Chuck gets back to the area to drop off with Bob but is only passing through and cannot meet up with him directly so passes on the snake to a mutual friend who will get it to him the next day. Now this is a very specific gene and when Bob gets it he calls Chuck and tells him it's not the one he was told it was. He then contacts Rob and with sending pics back and forth Rob agrees it isn't the one he said it was and that if he gets it back to Chuck he will swapped it out for the correct one. Now both knew he wouldn't see Chuck for another couple months and it was winter and not a time for shipping and both were fine with it. So now Cuck goes back to that area for Easter and gets the snake and is told by Bob that Rob was aware he was getting the snake and would meet up with Chuck on his way home since it was along the way and they lived over 2 hours apart. Once Chuck was within 1 hour of where they were to meet, Chuck texts Rob...no reply...agian,,,no reply...4 more times nothing. Now about 15 mins away he calls...no answer. So now Chuck drives by that area and heads home, make 4-5 more attempts. After getting home Chuck calls Bob and tells him. Bob calls Rob who answers and says something came up and would meet up with him at the next expo, but Chuck wasn't going to be able to make it. So Rob says he will meet up with him sometime. Now flash forward 3-4 months 3 shows later that Rob was to trade off the snakes later, but didn't make the shows for one excuse or another and was too too busy to drive and pick it up. Chuck once agian, after taking care of the snake for nearly 4 months heads out to the show and receives a text that he wasn't going to be there AGAIN because his car broke down(second time for that excuse). Chuck tells Bob and both are just getting pissed and feeling played.
Now this is where the bump in the road comes. On the wat from the expo, the display that was containing this snake as well as 5 other snakes dislodged the bar that held the lids shut and 6 animals got out. Somewhere between packing, loading, traveling, unloading, and take back into the reptile area they were gone. None where found. Chuck, pissed to no extent, texts Rob to tell him and actually received an immediate response. Keep me informed....really...after not answering all day, now can answer right away. Well Chuck was never able to find any of the escapees, and Rob feels he is no liable.
Can I get some opinions on this before advising if this should be pressed and go public. It's an usually one
Back to top Go down
Jabberwocky Dragons
VaHerp Board Member+
VaHerp Board Member+
avatar

Posts : 888

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Sun Oct 11, 2015 10:45 am

I had some difficulty following the story. Did one of the following two scenarios occur?:

1) Someone received a snake that was other than the advertised morph and the seller refused to make it right?

2) Someone paid for a snake and never received it?


Just a friendly reminder that while I think hypothetical scenarios like this are allowed, going public with names has to be done on a different site, like the BOI on Fauna, if you decide to go that course.
Back to top Go down
http://www.JabberwockyDragons.com
Thereddog
Member
Member
avatar

Posts : 25

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Sun Oct 11, 2015 11:01 am

Understood about going in public bio for naming names, that's why I wanted to get some opinions.
It's neither option 1 or 2. I wouldn't need opinions on that. I've been in this industry for 14 years. It's the complications that occurred due to a breeder stalling on making a deal right
1-breeder sold something that was supposed to be one thing and wasn't.
2-said he'd make it right but avoided doing so for several months
3- the person who was "trying to help" out 2 breeders was stuck holding, taking care of, and ultimately losing the snake because the first breeder dodged making the exchange for months and months after after he said he would.
I wanted the story to just be told without me leaning in any differ tigon.
Back to top Go down
Deedle
VaHerp Senior Crew
VaHerp Senior Crew
avatar

Posts : 917

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:25 pm

The person caring for the snake is the one responsible for the loss of it regardless of the situation.  Just my opinion.
Back to top Go down
bcr229
VaHerp Senior Crew
VaHerp Senior Crew
avatar

Posts : 458

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Sun Oct 11, 2015 8:01 pm

Bob owes Rob the correct snake or a refund.
Chuck owes Rob the value of the mis-sexed snake since he lost it.
Rob owes Chuck for care & feeders for the mis-sexed snake.



Last edited by bcr229 on Sun Oct 11, 2015 8:04 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Ok I think I finally got the people correct...)
Back to top Go down
http://www.ExtremeFirepower.com/
Jabberwocky Dragons
VaHerp Board Member+
VaHerp Board Member+
avatar

Posts : 888

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Sun Oct 11, 2015 11:32 pm

If I'm understanding correctly, I see two different situations here.

The first situation is the delay in getting the correct snake to the buyer. This should have taken place much earlier. I don't understand why it wasn't shipped during those several months. Winter isn't really a reason except for the coldest month or two of the year for most places. I don't know if I'd go public with a bad guy thread over the delay, but I could understand why somebody might... unless if prompt communication was given during the entire delay and the buyer was satisfied and reassured.

The second situation is the missing snake. Eventually, Rob gave Chuck the correct snake to give to Bob? This was agreed to by all parties and then the snake was lost while in Chuck's possession? If this is the case, then Rob is not liable at all for the lost snake. Rob's responsibility to getting the snake to Bob ended when he gave it to Chuck, the destination designated by Bob. The lost snake is now between Chuck and Bob.

I guarantee live delivery to the buyer. If Fed Ex delays the package and there's a DOA, I would cover that fully because that's my commitment as the seller. However, if I'm exporting to an international buyer, I guarantee live delivery to the exporter and then my commitment ends... it's the exporter's responsibility, once in their possession, to send to the seller. I view this second situation as very similar to a situation with an exporter.
Back to top Go down
http://www.JabberwockyDragons.com
Thereddog
Member
Member
avatar

Posts : 25

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:03 am

[quote="bcr229"]Bob owes Rob the correct snake or a refund.
Chuck owes Rob the value of the mis-sexed snake since he lost it.
Rob owes Chuck for care & feeders for the mis-sexed snake.

Bob didn't sell anything, he was to purchase a specific genetic snake. No Mis sexing involved. The snake that was actually lost was a normal and not the genetic as sold...Rob didn't care for anything....he sold a normal as a morph....
Back to top Go down
Thereddog
Member
Member
avatar

Posts : 25

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:19 am

Actually the "delay in delivery" was never an issue both Rob and Bob knew that Chuck( WHO WAS JUST DELIVING THE SNAKE) would be getting it for a little over a month and everyone was fine with that and isn't an issue at all in this....the snake wasn't return for 2 months because it was in a cold climate during the middle of winter and both Rob and Bob(actual buyer and seller) were both fine with that....that is the information leading to the actual issue. Rob and Bob agreed that in order to return the WRONG snake Bob would give to Chuck when he was in town to deliver back to Rob, who was to MEET CHUCK THAT DAY, On his way home....he didn't meet him or acknowledged his attempts to get a hold of him to make the exchange....then for 4 months, Rob, the seller of the wrong snake, dodged Chuck; who was JUST trying to exchange for Bob, to make the deal right.....Rob would either not return messages or say he would meet at this expo or that one, only to cancel going to the expo for one excuse or another...finally, on the last expo attempted delivery, one in which Rob once again had an excuse to miss, but not until that actual morning. Late enough that Chuck, who thought he would be finally making the trade off, was packed N in route to the expo....then due to an accident that allowed "the normal" snake and several others to get out n lost, Chuck did not have the "normal" to get back to Rob...and Rob who would not respond that entire day to Chucks attempts to get ahold of him to find out where and when he would make the exchange(because mind you it's been 4 months of being dodged...) Rob does not answer all till, till Chuck tells him it was missing.....then Rob responds immediately......
Back to top Go down
Jabberwocky Dragons
VaHerp Board Member+
VaHerp Board Member+
avatar

Posts : 888

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:56 am

Oh this makes it even easier then and very straightforward. Deduct the value of the normal snake from the value of the morph Bob should be getting. Bob and Rob should both split the expense of care and feeding while in Chuck's care if the delay was a mutual decision between Bob and Rob.
Back to top Go down
http://www.JabberwockyDragons.com
bcr229
VaHerp Senior Crew
VaHerp Senior Crew
avatar

Posts : 458

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Mon Oct 12, 2015 9:02 am

Thereddog wrote:
Bob didn't sell anything, he was to purchase a specific genetic snake. No Mis sexing involved. The snake that was actually lost was a normal and not the genetic as sold...Rob didn't care for anything....he sold a normal as a morph....
Sorry I got my Bob and Rob mixed up.

How about this:
The seller still owes the buyer the correct snake.
The seller owes the middleman the cost of care and feeders for the wrong snake.
The middleman owes the seller the value for the wrong snake since he lost it.
Back to top Go down
http://www.ExtremeFirepower.com/
Thereddog
Member
Member
avatar

Posts : 25

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Tue Oct 13, 2015 9:54 am

Thank you. That was my thinking all along. And even that Chuck may not be owed for car of the snake he wasn't supposed to even have, in exchange for the value of the incorrect snake...
Back to top Go down
Jabberwocky Dragons
VaHerp Board Member+
VaHerp Board Member+
avatar

Posts : 888

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Tue Oct 13, 2015 10:21 pm

Jabberwocky Dragons wrote:
Oh this makes it even easier then and very straightforward. Deduct the value of the normal snake from the value of the morph Bob should be getting. Bob and Rob should both split the expense of care and feeding while in Chuck's care if the delay was a mutual decision between Bob and Rob.

I don't know why I said to deduct the value of the normal as that makes no sense... I think I got mixed up with a recent BOI thread where the buyer wanted to keep the incorrect snake he received and settled on that. I meant the seller should be compensated for the lost normal whatever route that takes.
Back to top Go down
http://www.JabberwockyDragons.com
bcr229
VaHerp Senior Crew
VaHerp Senior Crew
avatar

Posts : 458

PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   Wed Oct 14, 2015 10:29 am

Thereddog wrote:
Thank you. That was my thinking all along. And even that Chuck may not be owed for car of the snake he wasn't supposed to even have, in exchange for the value of the incorrect snake...
Depends on how much value Chuck puts on his time, and remember you don't just drop a new snake into your rack with your established collection. New critters go into quarantine for three months, with the extra hassle that involves (isolation, separate equipment, etc) and in the meantime it's taking up a quarantine slot that can't be used for a snake he may want to purchase to further his breeding plans.

Plus if this was a normal male, well, they're not worth a whole lot anyway.
Back to top Go down
http://www.ExtremeFirepower.com/
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Would like some public opinion please!   

Back to top Go down
 
Would like some public opinion please!
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» What do you do if you see a dog getting abused in public?
» All Staffords must be muzzled in public as of last week (not really)
» Which public figure do you admire/look up to?
» wholesale saltwater fish to the public
» Drinking water from public fountains in Italy

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
VaHerps.com :: General Discussion Forums :: General Discussion-
Jump to: