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 Eastern Indigos

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Don
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PostSubject: Eastern Indigos   Fri Feb 24, 2012 8:22 pm

Anyone know if there are breeders in Virginia? I'm becoming fascinated with this snake.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Fri Feb 24, 2012 9:42 pm

crazy nasty species don. i'm with you. they're crazy to keep but worth it. there arent too many breeders around because of the interstate and ownership permits. they're regularly on fauna from reputable breeders. the price tag and lack of interest from the general public along with the special husbandry issues keep them to a small but intense circle of breeders. there is a forum for them called indigos forever. they cover all the species of drymarchon (check spelling on that one). not a whole lot of activity on it but a wealth of info if ur serious about them. good luck.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Fri Feb 24, 2012 9:54 pm

Thanks. That website went down last month for lack of renewal. I'm thinking it would be cool to breed these to help preserve the species. However, right now I'm more interested in learning more about them. They seem like super cool snakes. They are the largest snake in the US and super docile. I can't believe there aren't more people into them.

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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:17 pm

Brian Sharp has some. I don't know if he has any breeding size animals but when I got some stuff from him he mentioned he had them. I am looking at the texas indigos. I don't really want to mess with the interstate permits and Tom Crutchfield has some really nice ones.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Tue Feb 28, 2012 11:26 pm

there is a guy from northern VA, Jason Ayers selling a pair of TX indigos on KS.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Tue Feb 28, 2012 11:32 pm

Thanks, but I'm interested in Easterns which are different than Texans. I've got some good leads and am spending time learning about their needs and requirements. The more I learn about them the more I like them. They are really neat animals.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Feb 29, 2012 6:23 pm

let us know how long your permit takes to get. that is the main reason I haven't gotten any. I am too lazy to pay the fee when the snake costs so much.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Feb 29, 2012 6:30 pm

I'm really in the learning stages right now. Before I start buying any animal, I spend hours researching them. By the time an animal comes into my home, I have everything they will ever need and a full understanding of their needs. My interest in this snake is to potentially breed them to help preserve the species. So, I've got a lot of work to do before I apply for a permit.

From what I've learned so far, the caging alone will cost me about $1000 per snake. I'm looking at the Vision Cage that is large enough to house them. So, if I'm going to breed a treo, we are already up to $3,000 for cages that also take up a lot of room.

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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:37 pm

too bad the indigo forum isn't still up. there were some guys on there with really cool cages for their snakes.
$1000 for a cage?? what are you making it out of?
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Fri Mar 02, 2012 7:29 pm

wait till u see the "space station" cages. from what i've heard they cannot tolerate heat or humidity for extended periods. some of the cages i've seen give the snake a "tunnel" out of it's primary cage into another seperate cage which is usually not lit and heated only moderately. it's supposed to simulate the gopher tortoise burrows that they frequently inhabit in the wild. some that i've seen have taken up 10 feet of wall space. they are also usually taller than the normal boamaster or vision because indigos seem to like to climb from time to time. i hope u get to work with this species. i think for me it'll only be a goal until i have a home that can afford me the space for such a setup.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sat Mar 03, 2012 12:50 am

are there pics of them?
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sat Mar 03, 2012 1:34 pm

there were on the indigo forum. no one that i know of actually manufactures them for sale. it's usually an aftermarket addition. the way it looked to me was someone bought the large vision, boamaster, boaphile, etc and cut a hole 2 - 3" into the cooler side of the cage. thenadded a piece of pvc or other rigid tubing about 12- 18" long that connected the main cage to a smaller usually non viewable cage in the 1 foot to 2 foot range. this extra cage was usually kept heated only minimally. the idea of the whole set up is to give the snake the feeling of security as well as the ability to escape the heat and humidity of it's normal enclosure. from the stories i've heard if you don't truly love the species you won't last long in keeping them. they tend to be on the messier end of the keeping spectrum similar to pines and bulls but many have said even worse. i'm sure you can imagine that setup and the cleaning it would require.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sat Aug 11, 2012 10:06 pm

OK, I've started the permit process. Everyone said it was a cake walk, but it is pretty intrusive, if you ask me. You have to provide your SS#, birth date and write about your experience with similar species. I've got a deposit down on a beautiful little hatchling red throated girl. I'll see if I can find a pic.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sat Aug 11, 2012 10:11 pm



Hopefully, she will be coming home soon.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sat Aug 11, 2012 10:13 pm

She looks amazing Don. Good luck with the permit
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sat Aug 11, 2012 10:35 pm

Nice Don. Why do you need a permit? Or better yet, what type of permit?
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sat Aug 11, 2012 10:37 pm

Great looking animal!
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Don
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sat Aug 11, 2012 10:45 pm

Nick, you need a US Game and Wildlife permit to purchase and transport across state lines. It is going to take weeks, and I'm very impatient.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sat Aug 11, 2012 11:20 pm

Wow! Why is it so hard to get one? Is there something wrong with them?
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sat Aug 11, 2012 11:41 pm

Who did you end up buying from?
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Don
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sun Aug 12, 2012 8:41 am

rocialhabit wrote:
Wow! Why is it so hard to get one? Is there something wrong with them?

They are on the endangered threatened species list.

Bought from a guy in Louisanna.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Sun Aug 12, 2012 10:10 am

It's gorgeous!!!! Thanks for trying to keep the species alive Don!!! cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Mon Aug 13, 2012 10:27 am

man you are one lucky guy Don. have you gotten a set up together for her/him?
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Mon Aug 13, 2012 10:31 am

Man, that's awesome! Congratulations to you, I hope the permit goes through quickly and you get your new girl Smile

I know how you feel, Indigos are fascinating! I'm glad you managed to find one
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Tue Aug 28, 2012 9:27 pm

Got notification that the Florida office of US Fish and Wildlife Department approved my application and forwarded it on to the next step. I have no idea what that next step is, but hope it doesn't take long. This is like watching paint dry - government at work.

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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Tue Aug 28, 2012 9:38 pm

You're dealing with people who don't understand the passion!
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Tue Aug 28, 2012 9:39 pm

Still, congrats on getting one step closer!! I can't wait to see some pics! Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Tue Aug 28, 2012 9:41 pm

Actually the agent in Florida was very helpful and when he needed a new piece of information, he didn't reject the application, but called me and explained what was needed. He seemed to be excited about the process. Obviously, he couldn't have been a government employee for very long.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Tue Aug 28, 2012 9:50 pm

Glad you got a good f and w rep. Guess there at a few left in the dept. You're gonna love your indigo. Wish I was dealing with the same problem.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Tue Aug 28, 2012 9:58 pm

Can you post step by step what you had to do so others like myself contemplating getting an indigo know what to do and how to do it??
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Tue Aug 28, 2012 10:23 pm

Sure, First thing is to locate one you want to buy. Contact the seller and negotiate a price and ensure that they will hold the snake until you obtain the permit (and help you get the permit because you need their help).

Then you need to go to the US Fish and Wildlife site and get form 3-200-55. Located here: http://www.fws.gov/forms/3-200-55.pdf That form requires you to do a little more than just fill in the blanks. You have to attach a supplemental document that shows pictures of your enclosure, state your experience with similar reptiles and discuss the mortality rate in your collection.

You will also have to have a signed seller's statement attesting to selling you a captive bred snake with all of the information about the snake (hatch date, species, etc.). Oh, and you need to explain how the snake will be transported. The form has all of the required information. However, like I said it is not fill in the blank but you need to demonstrate your knowledge of reptile keeping.

The form is sent to the regional office that is responsible for the species in Atlanta. They forward it to the Florida office where it is processed and I think then it is sent back to Atlanta where they issue the permit.

Here is where I'm guessing - once you get the permit, you need to send a copy to the seller so they can include it in the shipping package. I'll find out for sure about that as soon as my permit has been approved.


I've also found someone in Virginia who is ordering and going through the same process for a breeding pair. I'm going to keep in touch with him because if I want to breed down the line, may do a breeding loan. I feel some kind of obligation once owning one to help perpetuate the species. In the wild, I have no doubt that they will be moved from threatened to endangered. They need a lot of space (several acres per snake) and gopher tortoise burrows to survive. Development is killing both species off.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 9:22 am

thanks.
one question. Do you have to have the enclosure before getting the permit or did you make drawings of what it would look like? ok more questions. Did they want to see an adult enclosure or just an empty tank???

I want indigos but didn't know the permit process was so lengthy!
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 10:25 am

You can do drawings. For the adult tank, which I do not have yet, I just took a copy of the picture on the website where I'm going to buy. You do not have to have the enclosure, but if you did, I think it would probably help.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 10:44 am

do you have a link to the enclosure don?
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:03 pm

the permit process is interesting to say the least!! So you have to wait to get the snake until you get the permit??
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:10 pm

Yup. Permit first, because that is what allows you to transport it across state lines. If you buy it in state, you do not need a permit.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:33 pm

Well we here might not need permits if don breeds later.. lol way to go don!!!!!!!! cheers smb2585
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 6:24 pm

Woooo go Don! Let us know when you have babies. Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 8:30 pm

HA HA! Sounds like you guys have me going down the breeding path. Only problem is I'm buying a hatchling, so she will not be ready for several years.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 9:38 pm

Well I guess we will just have to stay in touch! We will never go away! Very Happy Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 9:58 pm

I plan on using her as an educational snake. So, if we VAHERP.com'ers ever get our act together for a meet up, I'll bring this one along. She will stay away from my collection, because she will eat pythons! So, I don't have to worry about the usual quarentine procedures, because she will be in constant quarantine.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 10:22 pm

Don wrote:
I plan on using her as an educational snake. So, if we VAHERP.com'ers ever get our act together for a meet up, I'll bring this one along. She will stay away from my collection, because she will eat pythons! So, I don't have to worry about the usual quarentine procedures, because she will be in constant quarantine.

That sounds so awesome!!
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 10:24 pm

Wow she will eat pythons? Oh goodness. I can't wait to see it. Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Aug 29, 2012 10:35 pm

Yup, in the wild they eat other snakes, including rattle snakes, coral snakes, cotton mouths, and copperheads. They are immune to the venom. I don't think a ball python would be much of a challenge.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Thu Aug 30, 2012 12:06 am

nice. just don't post the pics on the FB. Tom Crutchfield did that of his King Cobra eating a bp morph and it went way overboard with the bp lovers. It was ridiculous to say the least.

I wish there were breeders in state. I have yet to see any advertised in VA.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Thu Aug 30, 2012 5:30 pm

b_rickard wrote:
nice. just don't post the pics on the FB. Tom Crutchfield did that of his King Cobra eating a bp morph and it went way overboard with the bp lovers. It was ridiculous to say the least.

I saw that picture and as a BP keeper and lover, I saw nothing wrong with it. Snakes gotta eat. Same thing I tell rodent lovers when they get offended that I keep snakes. Even if it was a "morph".

Same thing as lions eating antelope (or albino antelope, since it being a morph was apparently a big deal), wolves eating rabbits, squirrels eating acorns.

I agree that the reaction was absolutely insane.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Sep 05, 2012 9:27 pm

I'm still waiting on my permit. Hopefully it will be in soon. In the meantime, I've named her Ripley. A positive vote for the first person who knows why I chose that name.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Sep 05, 2012 9:35 pm

Don wrote:
I'm still waiting on my permit. Hopefully it will be in soon. In the meantime, I've named her Ripley. A positive vote for the first person who knows why I chose that name.

Anything to do with the Alien films?
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Sep 05, 2012 10:07 pm

David_Means wrote:
Don wrote:
I'm still waiting on my permit. Hopefully it will be in soon. In the meantime, I've named her Ripley. A positive vote for the first person who knows why I chose that name.

Anything to do with the Alien films?

Dang, that was quick.
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PostSubject: Re: Eastern Indigos   Wed Sep 05, 2012 10:09 pm

Sorry
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